The idea that a concept of time requires motion (space) is rather limited and
off
the point, don't you think?
Don
John J. Kineman wrote:
> Reply to Jack's comments on time:
>
> ......... BUT this dynamic is only possible with respect to some object
> >we define (by default assumption) as a static reference. The simplest
> >clock must have at least a static and a dynamic component. Since you can't
> >establish dynamic without comparision to a defined static, I think of this
> >as a qualitative measure.
>
> I agree with Jack's example, except for the conclusion that we can call
> this a "qualitative" and "objective" measure. The point is made clearly now
> that time is defined in terms of space (distance) and vice-versa. That
> makes the definition relative, not objective in the traditional sense (that
> the quantity being objectively measured is independent of the observation).
> It also establishes a causal loop between space and time. Intuitively this
> seems too indeterminate to match our everyday experience of objects and
> their stability (the Newtonian model). However, the effects of this
> relative and mutual causation are not seen at everyday scales of space and
> time. They show up at the extremes (cosmic and atomic scales). Very similar
> phenomena also show up in psychology and the experience of consciousness. I
> don't assume this similarity is an accident, because it clearly has
> something to do with the fabric of reality.
>
> But to make it all hang together with our previous notions
> (Newtonian/Cartesian) we have to offer a convincing explanation for why
> such a subjective arrangement between space and time can appear to be
> solidly objective in middle dimensions. Why does space and time appear
> independent and stable to us from a sensory mode of observation, when in
> reality they are not? I think Rosen's modeling relation can explain this
> when it is applied generally to all interactions (i.e., not just to
> individual observers such as humans thinking about something).
> -----------------------------------------------
> John J. Kineman, Physical Scientist/Ecologist
> National Geophysical Data Center
> 325 Broadway E/GC1 (3100 Marine St. Rm: A-152)
> Boulder, Colorado 80303 USA
> (303) 497-6900 (phone)
> (303) 497-6513 (fax)
> jjk@ngdc.noaa.gov (email)