Re: self-producing

Onar Aam (onar@HSR.NO)
Mon, 21 Aug 1995 21:02:54 +0100


In-Reply-To: Your message of "Mon, 21 Aug 1995 09:52:32 -0400 ." <199508211835.UAA25321@broremann.hsr.no>

>> Your choice of formal tool does not effect the answers
>> to big philosophical questions.
>
>Would this mean that some philosophical questions cannot be answered from
>the perspective of formal systems at all?

Of course! We only need to have a look at Godel's to know this.

>The hyper-set formalism, as I understand it, (and correct me if Im wrong)
>starts with accepting this "paradox" as not being a problem (it claims that
>that sets can be members of themselves), and then proceeds to establish
>theorems.

Let me add that one of the theorems that has been proven by Peter Aczel (I
think) is that IF hyperset theory is inconsistent then ordinary mathematics goes
down the drain with it. This is about the best insurance of consistency you can
have. In conclusion: there is nothing paradoxical about hyperset theory. It is
just another consistent formal system.

>Now, wouldn't
>hyperset theory be "bigger" than conventional set theory and therefor
>applicable to more philosophical questions (than conventional set theory)?

I would say so, yes. The extension from set theory to hyperset theory greatly
resembles the extension from Reals to Imaginaries. Both set theory and Real
algebra have a "black hole" in them. In set theory this is the paradox, in the
Reals this is the squareroot of negative numbers. Today Complex algebra has
numerous applications, and so will Hyperset theory have too.

>All mitosis demonstrates is that one autopoietic system can self-reproduce
into
>
>another autopoetic system. It doesnt answer the BIG question of how we could
>get something that wasnt yet autopoietic to become autopoietic. (the original
>kick-start). In molecular biology, with fiddling with the genomic makeup of a
>cell, we can alter an existing autopoetic system...but we havent created one
>denovo yet.

Autopoiesis from nothing is probably close to impossible. It has to take an
intermediate step into dissipative self-organization. (Autopoiesis is a special
kind of dissipative structure). Whether we can make it happen over again is an
open question.

Onar.